Bugging Up Vref, Pros and cons of increasing Vref. Options

[notanastronaut]

Dear Forum:

Would appreciate inputs and opinions on pros and cons of increasing Vref on approach when flying with steady headwind (no cross wind and no gusts).

Recently, the First Officer I was flying with, made the case for the need of increasing the Vref speed by 15 Kts as we were flying an approach to RNW 34 with a reported wind of 340/15. His argument was that by doing so we would compensate for the loss of ground speed, and basically there was no downside as the runway was long and surface conditions were dry.

I do not agree with this operating philosophy, but I am no "astronaut" so I welcome everyone's ideas.

Thanks for participating.

ANA

[Ranger]

I'm a simple guy so I'll write a simple post.

Vref is a FIXED number based on the conditions that exist. Vref= 1.3 X Vso. Vso= the stall speed of the airplane in a landing configuration. So ref speed is basically a speed that provides you a buffer from a stall during an approach in a landing configuration . Since it's basically a fixed number you don't "bug up" Vref. Most airlines have established procedures for calculating the final approach speed that they want to fly. I've worked for a company that used Vref + 10 knots and for companies that used Vref + 5 knots. At work, we apply the additive and then call it V approach, or Vapp. Wind additives are applied to Vapp. I could go into the procedures we use for figuring the wind additives but my guess is that it'd confuse most of you. It still confuses me.

I'm more than a bit surprised that an airline crew working an airplane that requires calculating speeds would even be having this kind of conversation. It should have been covered in training and published in their aircraft flight manual or in the limitations. Curious.

[bernoulli]

I'm a simple guy so I'll write a simple post.

Vref is a FIXED number based on the conditions that exist. Vref= 1.3 X Vso. Vso= the stall speed of the airplane in a landing configuration. So ref speed is basically a speed that provides you a buffer from a stall during an approach in a landing configuration . Since it's basically a fixed number you don't "bug up" Vref. Most airlines have established procedures for calculating the final approach speed that they want to fly. I've worked for a company that used Vref + 10 knots and for companies that used Vref + 5 knots. At work, we apply the additive and then call it V approach, or Vapp. Wind additives are applied to Vapp. I could go into the procedures we use for figuring the wind additives but my guess is that it'd confuse most of you. It still confuses me.

I'm more than a bit surprised that an airline crew working an airplane that requires calculating speeds would even be having this kind of conversation. It should have been covered in training and published in their aircraft flight manual or in the limitations. Curious.

Kinda thought you would chime in.

[Fast Jet]

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