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 TSA Concerns |
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 Nov 10 2008, 02:49 PM
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The Rant Master
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I recognize the frustration that some feel with having to go through all the procedures that have been put into place by the Transportation Security Agency (TSA). No one, I assure you, NO one, feels that frustration more than me. And it would be, no doubt, a terribly different circumstance that would exist for a good share of General Aviation if the folks running TSA feel it necessary to seek, and actually achieve, the changes in some of the laws as are described in the link that Becky posted. But, I’d offer this …
While it may seem to some that TSA personnel are “doing all they can to keep their jobs post 9/11…” actually, I think what it is that is being seen is the TSA following the “letter of the law,” as they have been instructed to do. Really, they have no choice. That is a huge problem with any enforcement agency. Unfortunately, the letter of the law – the way the law is written – is very important, not because of what it says, but rather “how” it is said. Take for example a rule that said something like “Any pilot with a private or higher level certificate must send to the FAA Administrator a check for $1.00 each year on the anniversary of his or her license issue date.” How many checks to do you think the FAA Administrator would get in the course of any given year? What if I told you “any pilot” meant “any pilot.” Becky is a pilot … so Becky could easily satisfy the “any pilot” requirement. So, if Becky sent in a check, that would satisfy that rule – no other pilot in the country would have to send a check to anyone. If the rule really meant that every pilot was to send in such the check, the rule should read, “Each pilot with a private or higher level certificate must send to the FAA Administrator a check for $1.00 each year on the anniversary of his or her license issue date.” With one word change there is a significant change in the application of the rule.
The TSA rules were written in haste – and they had some very heavy political limitations placed on them at the time. You may not recall, but at the time Secretary Norman Mineta was the head of the Dept. of Transportation and was very clear in his insistence that the US NOT single-out a specific section of the population based on any particular profile. He was (and I’m sure still is) very sensitive about such actions since his family is of Japanese descent and were imprisoned along with other Americans of Japanese descent immediately after the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor in 1941. So, when it comes to TSA searches, the rules prohibit “profiling.” With the utmost respect for the concerns that exist with any form of “profiling,” I believe it is awkward that, at the gate in Chicago, boarding a flight to Orlando, the group of 6 men; apparently in their early 30s; with dark complexions; having dark, long beards; carrying prayer shawls and copies of the Koran; standing at the window making and exchanging notes so that others will not overhear them … are subjected to exactly the same pre-boarding searches as the 70 year old Jewish grandmother in a wheel chair; with a daughter and 5 grandchildren; each with Mickey Mouse ears perched on their heads; and a holding bevy of Disney World balloons. I don’t know if any of you have ever traveled abroad, specifically to Israel, and therefore may have seen the very professional and seemingly nonchalant manner by which the El Al security personnel conduct their security business when boarding flights into that country. It is, to say the least, quite impressive. I think we could all learn a lesson from what and how they do those jobs … but, what do I know?
The citizens of a country whose history is deeply rooted in personal freedoms and long-standing rights of its citizens to go where ever, whenever, and however they choose, at any time they choose who are, all of sudden, being searched and interviewed and interrupted, and sometimes insulted – is a very difficult thing to understand. But, what is a basic fact is that the basic freedoms guaranteed to each US citizen (and essentially to each person entering or leaving the US) is precisely the feature that those intent on harming the US and its citizens will use to carry out their sick and demented goals. Applying “security” is 180 degrees counter to available freedoms and liberties. The fact is that the greater the security applied, the less freedoms and liberties may be held sacred. Its awkward to ask … but … what are we willing to trade for security? How much security is enough? How many freedoms and liberties are we willing to put on the shelf? Will we ever be able to pull them back off the shelf and put them back into operation?
I’m afraid that the answers to these questions are likely different for each person – at least until that person is subject to a violation of their security by someone intent on doing them harm or intent on taking something from them. Usually, the greater the security breech, the more freedoms and liberties that person is willing to endure.
For just a minute, put yourself in the role of a terrorist – intent on hurting the American population … American pride … American ideals. What could you do to inflict a massive amount of pain and concern and dread into the very soul of America? Now, what would you be willing to sacrifice to prevent that kind of event from happening? What would you be willing to give up in the way of General Aviation freedoms if a nuclear device was successfully exploded over the city of Chicago, carried by a King Air, ostensibly returning to Midway Airport from a fishing trip into the beautiful back country of Canada? Could such a thing happen? I certainly hope not … but what resources are currently deployed to prevent it from happening?
Becky, I completely understand your frustration – in fact I share it more than you probably know … but as long as there are those who would do the kinds of things that we’ve seen in New York, and London, and Madrid, and … unfortunately the list is way too long, I’m afraid that we are going to be sacrificing a lot of what we used to take for granted. And while the laws governing those sacrifices are written by men and women, the fact is the laws are going to be imperfect and have flaws – giving rise to the potential for different interpretations and differing practices. Eventually, those differences will likely be brought to a lesser level – hopefully eliminated … but … knowing what we all know about the laws in the US, that may not happen for a very long time. I guess, and I believe, as long as there are those whose intent is to rid the earth of America, this is the cost we are going to have to be willing to pay to live in the most free, most successful, and most productive land on the face of the globe!
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Nov 14 2008, 06:28 PM
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The Rant Master
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QUOTE(USMCmech @ Nov 12 2008, 12:28 PM) [snapback]129144[/snapback] The TSA is a complete sham. It has nothing to do with security, and only is there to make the public feel better. With all due respect, I think that may be just a bit of an overstatement. Sure, I recognize the limitations of any governmental agency – and the limitations that those agencies have placed on them are, for the most part, to help insure the continuation of the freedoms that Becky was describing. There are opposite ends of the same continuum – that is being completely secure and allowing everyone to have total freedom. Somewhere between those two points, logic has to exist. Every time we impose something to increase security it causes someone to lose some of what they may believe is a freedom, or privacy. Whether or not any governmental organization does all of what it is supposed to do is very much dependant on the circumstances at the time. We all have local police forces – the goal for whom is to thwart crime … but we all recognize that crimes take place anyway. Does that mean we should disband the police? Hardly! We may never know about the crimes that didn’t happen because of police presence. The TSA folks we see between the ticket counters and the airplanes in the airports across the US are not the entire TSA. Do these people provide a security service? Sure – at least to some degree. Are they fallible? Sure; they’re human. Do they keep potential hijackers off of airplanes? I don’t think there is a “cut-n-dried” answer here … but, probably they do. Will they absolutely prevent anyone from carrying on something that can be used as a weapon? No, probably not; but that is simply because almost anything can be used as a weapon. Perhaps it is as USMCmech says, and the most important thing the TSA screeners provide is making the traveling public “feel better.” Well, I think that is perfectly fine; and the reason they do feel better is that they can see an outward attempt to be sure (without strip-searching everyone) that the probability is reasonable that someone isn’t going to smuggle something on-board an airplane they are on and cause a problem. But, again, these screeners are not the entire TSA – and the TSA is charged with a horrendously important and very difficult job. Unfortunately, spilling the beans about just how effective they may be would be to provide some information about what those who would try to do harm of some sort may be able to do to avoid detection or discovery. Security must be sufficiently rewarding on a personal and job-function connected basis, to satisfy the men and women who do that job – as describing the details has never been something that is done. For one, I thank them every chance I get.
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Nov 14 2008, 08:50 PM
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Space Shuttle Member
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I seems like forever that I have had my personal freedoms curtailed by the threat of terrorism. Each and very year the noose that was placed around them by my government has been tightened. It does not take much imagination to forsee that all the freedoms I have will all but disappear. Why? Because my government, like yours, over-reacts to each and every terrorist incident and as a result ends up doing the job the terrorist set out to do in the first place.
Let's just look at a little bit of recent history. Not so many years ago, my routines were regularly disturbed by the IRA. I have even felt the blast (with not much force admittedly) of a truck full of Ammonium Nitrate and Fuel oil being detonated in the City of London and seen first hand, chards of glass from office blocks travelling hundreds of yards. I have had roads closed on me by the police, been told to get off trains in the middle of the night and had restrictions placed upon where I could and could not go. What really annoyed me was where a lot of the money, weapons and support for the IRA came from! But by listening, we have almost brought this conflict to an end. Allow two generations and continued good faith and we'll have this episode finished.
But as soon as we fixed one problem another surfaced. A few years ago our brothers in the Middle East also starting getting annoyed with us. There is a lot of "history" there but we did very little to try and befriend these people. In fact, what we did do really annoyed and insulted these guys and we are now paying the price. I can now see other people fuming, punching letters in the keyboards and calling me some kind of terrorist! I'm sure that there are people who would happily shoot me for my views. But the problem is, I'm not the only one. You can shoot me but it will not change the mind of others. It may even harden their views. But all I have so far done is to hold a contrary view to you. So how do you change my mind?
Dwell on this. If you can't change my mind, how do you change the mind of a suicidal fanatic? And don't even think for one minute that that they are stupid. Complacency like that lets the buggers in. But you do have to consider how you are going to contain and control the problem. What I'm hearing and seeing from this side of the water is that you have given these guys too much power. If they are anything like I imagine them to be they have low IQ's and love to abuse their authority. They'll be answerable no nobody and justify everything they do as they are acting in the nation's best interest - but for "security reasons" they can't disclose any threats.
The solution will not be found on the TSA's side of the water. Bombing the bad guys into submission won't work either because you'll have to bomb me as well! So what can you do? Short term - get personal (profiling - using the grey matter!). Yes, you'll pee a few people off alot but better that than offend everybody a little. But you'll not find a solution until you sort out your foreign policy. Your current one stinks and has got you into this mess. With your new President you have a real chance to make progress. I hope so.
Peace,
PM
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Nov 14 2008, 09:39 PM
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The Rant Master
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PM I don't disagree with almost everything you said. In fact, if you review my earlier posts on this thread, you'll see I'm not in favor of a blanket approach to screening - I think an intelligent form of "profiling" is absolutely necessary. However, there are some in the halls of government in the US that disagree and think that everyone should be treated equally - a point that is hard to argue against. My poiint is that TSA is more than screeners, and to that extent I'm more than willing to give TSA a chance at keeping us off the front pages of the world's newspapers. However, with our new President-elect, I think we're going to see a lot more of the kinder, gentler, approach to passenger interrogation - exactly opposite what you (and I) think it will take. I'm not exactly sure what mess it is you believe we are in, but we've already seen indications of what may come -- some of us are already bracing ourselves.
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Nov 15 2008, 07:30 AM
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AirRabbit (or should it be Brear Rabbit) - we are certainly on the same side! But personally I believe that the TSA will do little more for you than to make a "front page incident" only slightly less likley to occur, no matter what brains they employ behind closed doors. But the price they are charging to do this (excluding the cash), the removal of your civil liberties, the very thing which are trying to protect, may be not be a price worth paying. You will also find that they are more difficult to get rid of than herpes when the existing threat deminishes. Believe me, they'll find another threat to replace it! But the only way is to remove the current threat (and we are talking about religious extremists here) is to try and change their mindset but more importantly the opinions of those who support them. And that will require a change of foreign policy. As soon as clear, honest (ie. non-hypocritcal), consistent and transparent policies are introduced you will be well on the way to solving this particular problem. It will take time, but this will provide a permanent solution.
And Harmattan, "MAKS" where's that?
PM
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Nov 15 2008, 01:50 PM
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The Rant Master
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QUOTE(Piltdown Man @ Nov 15 2008, 06:30 AM) [snapback]129416[/snapback] AirRabbit (or should it be Brear Rabbit) - we are certainly on the same side! But personally I believe that the TSA will do little more for you than to make a "front page incident" only slightly less likley to occur, no matter what brains they employ behind closed doors. But the price they are charging to do this (excluding the cash), the removal of your civil liberties, the very thing which are trying to protect, may be not be a price worth paying. You will also find that they are more difficult to get rid of than herpes when the existing threat deminishes. Believe me, they'll find another threat to replace it! But the only way is to remove the current threat (and we are talking about religious extremists here) is to try and change their mindset but more importantly the opinions of those who support them. And that will require a change of foreign policy. As soon as clear, honest (ie. non-hypocritcal), consistent and transparent policies are introduced you will be well on the way to solving this particular problem. It will take time, but this will provide a permanent solution.
PM I’m certainly not as magical or as tricky as good ole Br’er Rabbit and I certainly understand the speculation about the viability of yet another governmental agency. But let me relay just one story – the substance of which has been declassified and released to help US citizens obtain a glimpse of what kind of things TSA can do … The incident occurred almost 2 years ago – New Year’s Eve 2006/2007 – in Las Vegas; yes, the modern day “sin city.” As you may know, every New Year’s Eve, there is a huge parade and miles long “block party” down “the strip” in Las Vegas. As part of routine monitoring of scheduled large gatherings of people, there were some who were monitoring the frivolity to see if there was anything sinister that might be taken advantage of by anyone seeking to do harm. There are instruments – commonly known as “sniffers” – that take air samples and analyze the content to see if there are airborne hazards that might be present. One of the folks assigned to observe these activities had one of these devices working … and it set off an alarm. After quickly determining that this was not some malfunction or some false positive – this person contacted his/her headquarters – who immediately contacted Washington. I cannot say whether or not the issue was ever brought to the attention of either President Bush or Vice President Cheney, but it is likely. Anyway, Washington dispatched a special team to Las Vegas, arriving before the New Year’s Eve parade was over. Total time lapse now about 4 hours – indicating that the team was not domiciled in the Washington area. Arriving on the scene – the corner of a block where the first readings were made. Even more sensitive equipment was activated and prior to sunrise, the team had determined that the readings (and it was radioactive readings that caused the intensity) were coming from a self-storage unit, one block off of the main strip in Las Vegas. The typical SWAT-type team, (all wearing radiation suits) closed on the 1-car-garage-type storage unit and began to open the overhead door. As they were opening it, a bedraggled man, in tattered clothes and a week’s growth of beard, stumbled out asking what was going on. The short description was that this homeless man, about 6 months earlier, had been rummaging around the waste bin of the local hospital and found what looked like a cigar holder – but he couldn’t figure out how to open it – it was highly polished – and about the size of a cigar holder. Later it was determined to be a medical storage cylinder for the smallest quantity of medically used radioactive material for injection into the blood stream for tracking purposes. The container, with a registration number and all, was not disposed of properly, and wound up in the hospital’s garbage. This homeless man found and kept the small cylinder for “good luck.” He kept it in his knap sack that he used as a pillow when he slept. He had figured out the combination of the lock for the storage unit and periodically used that place as a warm and secure shelter. Normal equipment could not detect any radioactivity from the tube. Medical examination of the man determined that he had not suffered any ill effects from the 6-month exposure to the tube, even though the man said he had slept on it every night for those 6 months. Obviously, there wasn’t a lot of radioactivity present. Yet, the equipment used that New Year’s Eve, the size of a normal looking briefcase, picked up the fact that it was there, through concrete block walls, a block and half away from the source. My point is that there is a lot going on behind those closed doors. Most of which is not disclosed because there is no sense in telling the “bad guys” how we might be able to detect them and give them an opportunity to change their strategy. I also agree with you that, while sacrificing personal liberties for security is a very tenable decision, it is also full of potentials – some of which are good and some of which are not so good. There are, as you would likely know with your experiences, more than a few ways to address the problems that face the world by these religious extremists. Obviously, there isn’t one method on which everyone is likely to agree. And while I certainly agree that once some restrictions are adopted they may well be very difficult to remove or replace. Everyone knows that the US has just completed a very emotional and sometimes bitter national election. The winner of that election is going to be the new President of this country. I also recognize that there are a lot people living both inside and outside the US that have formed an opinion of the likelihood of this “new” or “changed” administration making things better. I pray that is true. But here is an excerpt from a speech delivered not long before the vote was taken. You tell me where something like this is likely to go... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt2yGzHfy7s...and, please note the air of "finality" and of "conviction" in the facial expression after the statement is concluded. (Sorry guys, the "insert special item" didn't work for this link ... I tried)
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Nov 15 2008, 05:06 PM
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The Rant Master
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QUOTE(Ranger @ Nov 15 2008, 01:33 PM) [snapback]129460[/snapback] I share AirRabbits concerns. It's already started. His party is making the preliminary plans to turn tail and run in Iraq. Sorry, folks. That's the way I feel. I have up close and personal experience with turning tail and running. We did it in the war that I fought in. In spite of that, if they'd take fat,old guys with really bad attitudes, I grab my ruck sack and my rifle and join this party. Especially if it meant letting some young guy with young kids stay at home and make his wife miserable.
PM, there are more definitive ways to deal with the current problems. We just haven't worked up the cajones to take it to the level that it needs to go to. Black Jack Pershing has turned into one of my personal heroes. He did it right.
I fear for my country. Ranger is, again, right on target. He is describing those within the US – and I would think it likely that there are some outside the US – who ideologically “believe” that any disagreement can be settled with intelligent talk. The problem here is a basic misunderstanding of what constitutes intelligence – for these ideological believers, intelligence is an understanding of “give-and-take,” “mutual-support,” “you-give-me-what-I need-and-I’ll-give-you-what-you-need” intelligent talk. What these well-meaning but misinformed persons either fail to realize or refuse to believe is that there are some who are simply not interested in what “we” want – these religious jihadists are only interested in what “they” want - what they believe they deserve. They aren’t interested in bargaining. They believe they are doing God’s work and therefore, do not need to enter into talks with anyone about anything. Of course, if doing so on the surface will advance their primary objective – they’ll do what ever it takes. They have shown us, over and over again, just what they are willing to do – yet our well-meaning friends continue to deny the facts – insisting on “playing nice” and believing that soon everyone on the playground will be happy – and simply not believing that the goal of our sworn enemies is to own the playground. These enemies of ours have had this attitude since their expansion upward into central and eastern Europe was stopped and reversed hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years ago. They’ve maintained a constant attitude for those same hundreds of years. Today, their focus is trained on what they call “The Great Satan,” the U.S. You probably know that Israel is called “The Little Satan.” They don’t hate the west because of Israel, they hate Israel because of the west – and the United States particularly! It is the US who is the enemy of these religious jihadists – it is the US they want to see gone from the face of the earth. Once they achieve that goal, the remainder (at least in their minds) is “a piece of cake.” And they’ve been emboldened on repeated occasions – the first was the relative ease in taking over the state of Iran and taking the US embassy hostage in 1979 (…and, here’s a fact you may not have known - the US orders to the Marines standing guard at that embassy was “do not resist”); and the second was the Soviet defeat in Afghanistan in the late 1980s. Of course there have been others, but none quite so dramatic – that is until they hijacked 4 US airliners and crashed 3 of them into the Twin Trade Towers and the Pentagon. What do you think a withdrawal from Iraq or Afghanistan would say to these religious jihadists? Immediately after the 9/11 attacks, the US Congress asked former Israeli Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, to testify before them on security matters. His comments were probably THE most sobering comment I’ve heard from a foreign head-of-state. He said, “Today the terrorists have the will to destroy us, but they do not have the power. There is no doubt that we have the power to crush them. Now we must also show that we have the will to do just that. Once any part of the terror network acquires nuclear weapons, this equation will fundamentally change, and with it the course of human affairs.” Here is a link to the text of his entire speech - http://www.freewebs.com/jeffhead/attack/netanyahuspeech.htmUnfortunately, until something like this happens, there will continue to be attempts to ensure the security of Americans – both abroad and at home. Some of these attempts will be spectacular and some will be mediocre, but unfortunately, until it is put into action, most of these actions will not be able to be judged until after the fact. I say again, the Dept. of Homeland Security and the Trasnportation Security Agency are doing a job that's next to impossible - and they're doing it relatively well. Yes, they make mistakes. Yes, we all are affected. But what we do and what we don't do sends messages. Doing something - anythng - sends a better message than doing nothing - than "not resisting."
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Nov 15 2008, 08:37 PM
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I read different newpapers, watch news with a different slant and skew and live in a different part of the world. I also don't buy from people with vested interests. I therefore see things differently. I do see the religious nutters for what and who they are but also see that they are in a small minority. A damn loud one, very dangerous but still a minority. They are probably not controllable so therefore don't even try. Instead, work with those who can make their lives difficult so they they can be isolated (and we aren't talking about Guantanamo here) and deprived of support and succour. Let them fade away.
But honestly guys, things are not as bad as you paint. Let's just look at Iran. If I read the Iranians I speak to correctly, you will very soon end with friends - or at worst, people who are not your enemy. The moderate youth of Iran, the people who you don't hear about (their story won't sell papers) want the internet, Hollywood movies, to go sking (oh yes!), fashion, cars, meet with friends and hang out. They can't stand the wrinkly religious zealots who run their country, they want change. They will get that change eventually, provided nobody does anything stupid. If you push them they will choose they, like you, will stand by their own country first. Let them be and stop anybody else interfering.
PM
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Nov 15 2008, 10:27 PM
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The Rant Master
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All well and good given enough time for those desires to become more widespread and to have the older wrinkly religious zealots die off while the world maintains a relatively stabilized existence. Unfortunately, from what I understand, there are enough religious zealots who are raising their children to disregard what they call “the western lies and depraved way of life” we lead – in preference for the Allah-rewarding life style that will give them every conceivable desire in their next life – to raise my “worry quotient.” The world over the past 3 decades has not maintained what I would call a relatively stabilized existence. It seems to me (and others) that the attitudes of these wrinkly religious zealots are becoming less thought and more action – and when whatever “action” they take is met with little if any resistance (I give you the siege of the American Embassy in Tehran – where the orders from the US president was “do not resist”) it only verifies to them that Allah is, indeed, on their side and they have but to follow his teachings … as interpreted by the various older wrinkly religious zealots who preach death and destruction. I completely agree with attempting to work with those who can make the lives of the wrinkly religious zealots (as you can tell, I really do like that description) more difficult. Unfortunately, many here in the US, would loudly protest were there any “official” effort on the part of the US seen as interfering with the internal political or religious decisions of a sovereign country. Heck, most of those who feel that way, would hemorrhage purple paint if they got wind of the US being involved in even the most clandestine manner to achieve the same ends. Therefore, these groups advocate sitting down with whomever and having long term discussions – firmly of the opinion that surely these political and religious matters can be logically discussed and have these lesser zealots turn from their historic followings and find peace, love, and happiness in those things that we can obviously offer them. I pray that the more tolerant attitudes you describe gain a firm ground in those areas and oust those who would go in a more terror-driven direction. That, or these youths who prefer the western way of life will leave their countries to the wrinkly religious zealots so that they can see the imminent death of the course they have chosen. Somehow, I think that is not likely. As you have pointed out – these terrorists are not stupid. And as long as they can obtain what they want in the form of western decadence during the week, and then gain absolution from the Mullahs or Clerics during prayers, I think the long term change does not favor what you and I would prefer. I think the wrinkly religious zealots have already recognized that it’s going to come down to a decision of the current youth between Allah and western decadence. That is why, in my opinion, there has been a resurgent focus on religious Muslim teachings around the world. And, when the western world maintains an absolute tolerance of ALL the world’s religions, I can’t help but wonder if we really know what we’re doing. The next time you have discussions with Iranians – ask about those who are even younger than those with whom you are talking – ask what path this more youthful crowd is more likely to take. The information about which I am aware paints a picture with a remarkably different backdrop. Western decadence is tolerated as long as the fundamental Muslim faith is not corrupted. Whatever it takes to get to the desired goal. For example look at the UK, look at France, look at some of the Scandinavian countries, look at Canada – take into consideration that Ontario, Canada, has authorized the use of Sharia Law in civil arbitrations. Here’s a link: http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/arch...02076print.htmlI don't think the world is quite as "westernized" or has "westerized goals" as you might believe - at least in the long term.
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Nov 16 2008, 01:02 AM
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The Master Baiter
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QUOTE(Piltdown Man @ Nov 15 2008, 04:37 PM) [snapback]129475[/snapback] But honestly guys, things are not as bad as you paint. Let's just look at Iran. If I read the Iranians I speak to correctly, you will very soon end with friends - or at worst, people who are not your enemy. The moderate youth of Iran, the people who you don't hear about (their story won't sell papers) want the internet, Hollywood movies, to go sking (oh yes!), fashion, cars, meet with friends and hang out. They can't stand the wrinkly religious zealots who run their country, they want change. They will get that change eventually, provided nobody does anything stupid. If you push them they will choose they, like you, will stand by their own country first. Let them be and stop anybody else interfering.
PM Holy doo-doo, PM, you have got to be kidding. You honestly buy that? Who the hell is in charge in Iran? The rock and roll yutes (My Cousin Vinny!) or the old wrinkled dudes who not only want to destroy us but also encourage the same yutes that you so whole heartedly endorse to sign up for jihad? Let's get this straight; THE YUTES DO NOT HAVE A CHOICE! They live in a religious, totalitarian society where they can be picked up and charged with weird crap like "opposing the word of God" or "resisting religious education." Ya, I'm making those things up but I hope you get my point. I'm sorry that you don't like the way that the US has handled things for the past few years. Actually, no I'm not. Please don't take this personally but I really don't much care what others think any more. We were atttacked and we responded. Personally, I make no apologies for that. We may not have handled it perfectly, but we did the best that we could. I am not in favor of feel good, kiss 'em on the forehead politics. I'm more of a kick 'em in the a$$ kinda guy. If we kick hard enough and often enough I honestly believe that eventually they'll figure out that they can't win the way that they want to win. We just haven't gotten to the point where we have the cajones for that. And the guy that we just voted in is certainly NOT going to take us in that direction. Damn, AirRabbit is rubbing off on me. Rant over.
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Nov 16 2008, 02:57 AM
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Boeing 737 Member
Group: Full Access Members
Posts: 143
Joined: 4-September 05
Member No.: 2,054
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QUOTE(Ranger @ Nov 15 2008, 10:02 PM) [snapback]129480[/snapback] Holy doo-doo, PM, you have got to be kidding. You honestly buy that? Who the hell is in charge in Iran? The rock and roll yutes (My Cousin Vinny!) or the old wrinkled dudes who not only want to destroy us but also encourage the same yutes that you so whole heartedly endorse to sign up for jihad? Let's get this straight; THE YUTES DO NOT HAVE A CHOICE! They live in a religious, totalitarian society where they can be picked up and charged with weird crap like "opposing the word of God" or "resisting religious education." Ya, I'm making those things up but I hope you get my point.
I'm sorry that you don't like the way that the US has handled things for the past few years. Actually, no I'm not. Please don't take this personally but I really don't much care what others think any more. We were atttacked and we responded. Personally, I make no apologies for that. We may not have handled it perfectly, but we did the best that we could. I am not in favor of feel good, kiss 'em on the forehead politics. I'm more of a kick 'em in the a$$ kinda guy. If we kick hard enough and often enough I honestly believe that eventually they'll figure out that they can't win the way that they want to win. We just haven't gotten to the point where we have the cajones for that. And the guy that we just voted in is certainly NOT going to take us in that direction.
Damn, AirRabbit is rubbing off on me. Rant over. Amen.
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